> On the other side, my mom defended me from bullies, drove me to school every day, cared for me and could be really sweet... This is confusing to me
This is precisely the reward-and-reinforcement mechanism people like Theo Lidz, Gregory Bateson, Paul Watzlawick, John Weakland, Don Jackson, Jay Haley, Virginia Satir, Jules Henry, Ronald D. Laing and Aaron Esterson saw two and three generations ago in the families of origin of their schizophrenic patients. And that Diana Baumrind ultimately saw after she did her original work on the various parenting styles. Having worked with well over a hundred people with BPD (not suggesting you have it), I have seen the flip-flop mother -- pretty likely stuck in learned helpless codependence to the intimidating, abusive, narcissistic father -- so many times in the families of origin of the BPD pts that I'm relatively certain it's a fairly common etiological set-up. In whatever event...
1) Substance Abuse: IF one is abusing alcohol, nicotine in any form, or other rec or Rx substances, they'll have to stop. SA can cause -- or worsen -- this in people with specific genetics and behavioral conditioning (see below). Alcoholics Anonymous, Marijuana Anonymous and/or Narcotics Anonymous can be helpful. Or using the SAMHSA facility locator online to find a detox & rehab.
2) If one is NOT doing the above, they may need lab work to determine if they have hormonal (e.g.: thyroid) or metabolic (e.g.: low Vitamin D3) imbalances. See a competent MD, DO, PA or NP. (To find one in your area, use the clinician locators mentioned below or get a referral from your GP/PC doc.)
3) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do next seven things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the physician locators below. Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
4) Support Groups: Adult Children of Alcoholics / Dysfunctional Families (ACA), Emotions Anonymous (EA), and Codependents Anonymous (CoDA)... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions. All of their websites have meeting locators.
5) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed into fight, flight or freeze for too long, including complex PTSD: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. Look for an online article entitled "Treat Autonomic AND Cognitive Conditions in Psychopathology?" to get you oriented. Accurate information is power. More books:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
6) Psychotherapy: I currently use Ogden's Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T) as the "interoceptive" 9th of The 10 StEPs of Emotion Processing to manage any C-PTSD time bombs that turn up, but had good results over the years with several of the
. . . a) cognitive behavioral therapies (CBTs), including Rational-Emotive Behavioral Therapy (REBT), collegiate critical thinking, and Schema Therapy; the
. . . b) "super" (or mindfulness-based) CBTs like Mindfulness-Based Cognitive Therapy (MBCT), Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT), Acceptance & Commitment Therapy (ACT), Mind-Body Bridging Therapy (MBBT), and Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR); and the
. . . c) "deep cleaners" like Eye-Movement Desensitization & Reprocessing (EMDR), Hakomi Body Centered Psychotherapy (HBCP), Somatic Experiencing Psychotherapy (SEPt), Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T), and the Neuro-Affective Relational Model (NARM).
One can look up all of those by name online. The CBTs deconstruct one's inaccurate beliefs, values, ideals, principles, convictions, rules, codes, regulations and requirements about how we or they (or the world) should / must / ought / have to be. DBT, MBCT, ACT, MBBT and MBSR are terrific for emotional symptom management. EMDR, HBCT, SEPt, SP4T and NARM are first-rate for memory-reprocessing, sense-making and detachment from the conditioning, programming, etc.
To find the clinicians who know how to use these psychotherapies, look on the "therapists" and "psychiatrists" sections of the Psychology Today.com clinician locator, or the "find-a-doctor/specialty/psychiatry" section of the WebMD website; the SAMHSA's treatment facility locator, and -- for DBT specialists in particular -- on the Behavioraltech.org website. If you dig a little on each page, you will be able to see which therapies they use. Then interview them as though they were applying for a job with your company. Most psychiatrists, btw, are not therapists themselves (they are medication specialists), but can refer you to those who are, and are often excellent sources of referral.
7) Mindfulness Meditation: Try the Vipassana or Theravada Meditation styles? (For a lot of people with anxiety, unwanted mania and depression, this stuff handles them all chop chop. Many of the modern "mindfulness"-based psychotherapies are actually based on these now.) The article "The Feeling is Always Temporary" at pairadocks.blogspot.com provides a nice summation of it.
8) Therapy Workbooks: I got a lot of lift-off by using inexpensive workbooks built on CBT, ACT, DBT, MBBT and MBCT workbooks like these, and these, and these, and these.
9) Moderate Exercise: Because it is the single healthiest of the distractions one can use to yank oneself out of the paradigm for a while... and it can help to "massage" the brain so that it responds more quickly to psychotherapy.
10) Diet: A lot of people with depression, mania and/or anxiety eat very poorly. Junk food -- not to mention too little nutritious food -- will definitely impact those who are overly stressed and make symptoms worse. High-quality frozen meals are better than McFood of almost any kind, but HQ fresh (especially Mediterranean -- though not pizza -- and Asian) food appears to be best for pts with C-PTSD symptoms. Healthy fats in moderation, btw, are known to be good for depression. Add a 1000 IU soft gel of Vitamin D3, too.
Of the ten, #3 and #6 are the only ones that cost much, and several are totally free.
by not-moses 2018-03-19
The Adult Children of Alcoholics & Dysfunctional Families perspective, for sure. Been around for about 40 years now. Good stuff.
If you're "bookish," at all, you can find out where the LC got most of her ideas:
Anonymous: Adult Children of Alcoholics: Alcoholic / Dysfunctional Families, Torrance, CA: ACA World Service Office, 2006.
Bradshaw, J.: Bradshaw On: The Family, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications, 1990.
Friel, J.; Friel, L.: Adult Children of Dysfunctional Families: The Secrets of Dysfunctional Families, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications Inc., 1990.
Whitfield, C.: The Child Within: Discovery and Recovery for Children of Dysfunctional Families, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications Inc. 1987.
Woititz, J. G.: Adult Children of Alcoholics, Pompano Beach. FL: Health Communications, 1983.
Woititz, J. G.; Garner, A.: Life Skills for Adult Children of Alcoholics, Pompano Beach, FL: Health Communications, 1990.
I usually reject the notion of "permanent policy" in favor of "being with what is right now in relationship." But...
Anyone who saps my energy without providing some replacement gets dropped. That may sound totalistic, but figure this: There are only so many minutes in the day to be of service to others who really need and want help. If they show me they are...
1) stuck at stage one of the five stages of therapeutic recovery or Kubler-Ross's five stages of grief processing,
2) resistant to rational and appropriate suggestions, or
3) the third of the four types of BPD, psychotically paranoid, righteously narcissistic and self-obsessed, passive-aggressive, anti-social or sociopathic...
I go into full-on counter-dependent, Ayn Rand Objectivist / lifeguard-with-a-non-swimmer-who-won't-follow-directions mode. (I am not "emotionally bullet-proof." I still need a bullet-proof vest.)
Because... the adequate and capable person who allows him- or herself to get sucked into the denial and/or resistance of those who want to be "rescued" (especially if their real motive is to "persecute") on a Karpman Drama Triangle with me will "victimize" and drown me if I let them. And those who really want and need help won't get it. Will they?
Might be worth reading some or all as processing devices:
Insofar as coping with their intrusions is concerned...
1) Keep the ringer on your phone off, and screen all calls and texts;
2) Change your email address, informing only those you know and trust;
3) Dump any social media accounts you have, or shut them down for the time being;
4) Know your persecutor (get him "right sized" instead of "bigger than you"): On Bullies and interpersonal D.A.R.V.O.;
5) Learn about learned helplessness, emotional blackmail and how to deal with them;
6) Keep this in mind: The Feeling is Always Temporary;
7) Learn & practice Distress Tolerance & Emotion Regulation.
by not-moses 2018-02-16
> "I'm ignoring you while still vaguely acknowledging your existence in an abusive way" from a distance to try and break me and there's something in me that keeps digging for some kind of oral truth he'll never supply -- which drives me crazy and keeps me trapped
Only if we but their stuff as having some element of truth to it, make a down payment and then make installment payments on their utterances every time they make them. I'd look into "attachment theory" in general and "ambivalent" and "disorganized" attachment in particular. (John Bowlby was the big name in that stuff. It's definitely worth looking into because is the "fuel" that powers relationships on the Karpman Drama Triangle. The "persecutor" in the upper corner there is often "Mr. Revenge" to try to get out of the "victim" corner at the bottom.
> part of my mind froze over and is stuck
Of course. Children don't have the wherewithall to get out of the "victim" corner. And if a persecuting parent (or other authority figure) keeps shoving them down into the victim corner, they get conditioned, socialized and [normalized](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization_(sociology) to the whole drama in the brain's default mode network.
Hmm. Might wanna read some of these, even thought they tend to be about parents. If one understands that they may have found a new version of one or both parents in a romantic relationship -- and transferred the unprocessed emotions from the original onto the new one because it is similar in some ways -- it can help to connect some major mental dots sufficiently to give something like the 10 StEPs of Emotion Processing, Eye-Movement Desensitization & Reprocessing (EMDR), Narrative Exposure Therapy (NET), Internal Family Systems Therapy (IFST), Trauma Focused Therapy (TFT), Hakomi Body Centered Psychotherapy (HBCP), Somatic Experiencing Psychotherapy (SEPt), Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T), or the Neuro-Affective Relational Model (NARM) a chance to "digest" those emotions.
Left untreated, my parents' abuse did little other than fester, and at times erupt in unfortunate ways.
> She used to stare at me with squinted eyes, and would randomly blurt out things that she had somehow “figured out” about me, most of which was untrue and weird.
I never thought I'd ever read anyone else's description of that experience.
> it seems like she thought she knew me more than I knew myself, and really enjoyed telling me insights about my behavior and making assumptions.
"Righteous narcissism." Once I understood why my own mother needed that so desperately as a defense against her own fear of being abused again (and be denied her reality as her mother and grandmother had denied it after she was raped by her cousin when she was nine), I could see her and I very clearly pushing each other around on our little Karpman Drama Triangle. Sick.
I had to read book like these (below) and steep myself in ACA and CoDA to get the bitterness to subside.
Alexander Chapman & Kimberly Gratz's The Borderline Personality Disorder Survival Guide: Everything You Need to Know About Living with BPD
Block, S.; Block, C.: Mind-Body Workbook for Anger, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2013.
Chapman, A.; Gratz, K.; Tull, M.: The Dialectical Behavior Therapy Skills Workbook for Anger: Using DBT Mindfulness & Emotion Regulation Skills to Manage Anger, Oakland CA: New Harbinger, 2015.
Eifert, G.; McKay, M.; Forsyth, J.: ACT on life not anger: The New Acceptance & Commitment Therapy Guide to Problem Anger, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2006.
Harbin, T.: Beyond Anger: a guide for me: How to Free Yourself from the Grip of Anger and Get More Out of Life, New York: Marlowe & Company, 2000.
McKay, M.; Rogers, P.: The Anger Control Workbook: Simple, innovative techniques for managing anger and developing healthier ways of relating; Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2000.
McKay, M.; Rogers, P.; McKay, J.: When Anger Hurts: Quieting the Storm Within, 2nd Ed., Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2003.
Simpkins, C. A.; Simpkins, A. M.: The Tao of Bipolar: Using Meditation & Mindfulness to Find Balance & Peace, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2013.
Stahl, B.; Goldstein, E.: A Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction Workbook, Oakland CA: New Harbinger, 2010.
by not-moses 2018-02-16
Rule of thumb for this abusee: NEVER confront an abuser without giving it plenty of forethought.
Here's a pick-up that may be pointless after the corral gate got opened and the horses ran off, but...
Confronting Abusers & Handling Rage Effectively
And... as regards dealing with the upshots:
Recovering from Shame
The Feeling is Always Temporary
Distress Tolerance & Emotion Regulation
Finally, some books to help your process the abuse without getting into it with either parent:
I've been a witness to this on several occasions. Some won judgments. Others got nothing but grief. And the ones who "won" judgments paid a significant price during the depositions they had to give the defense attorneys.
What you elect to do is your own business, of course. I could have "played nice" and come away with a pretty good nest egg when my adoptive mother finally passed. But she was such an insufferably self-righteous fraud (as well as abusive to my spouse), that I just walked away. After reading books like those listed below, I'm convinced now that I would have done myself a lot more damage to just remain in contact, let alone have to fight with her and her attorneys for a few years.
We're seeing more and more of this from the second-, third- and fourth-generation victims of traumatized mothers who tried to cope with their unfinished business by trying to control everyone and everything around them to whatever extent possible. Sigh.
> the leaders of this church are extremely manipulative, they would tell my mom I️ was the devil, that I️ was possessed because I️ listened to the radio, that I️ was teaching all the other children to do bad things.
Another widely observed phenomenon among survivors. To that end, may I suggest having a look at the articles at the links below? (I was raised in an extreme, evangelical Xtian world, btw. And it set me up to chase "The Answer" in one cult after another in my 20s and 30s.)
Codependence & Cults
Coercive Persuasion in Cults
I had to be de-programmed from the instruction, conditioning, indoctrineation, socialization, habituation and (invisible to me) normalization of my home and church (as well as other cult) upbringing... after all that brainwashing took me the gates of CPTSD hell (including 11 hospitalizations and two wake-up-in-the-ICU suicide attempts) from '94 to '03. I'm not in that box / frame / institution / paradigm anymore. And how I got from there to here is summarized in the earlier post at the link below:
From Bipolar to Borderline to Complex PTSD: The Long Way Around the Recovery Barn
Hmm. Some books that were helpful for me that may be helpful for you:
Pretty similar FoO background here. Had to do all the stuff listed in the earlier post at the link below to dig out of the upshots to the extent that I have. Have also read and done the work suggested in the books listed after that first link.
From Bipolar to Borderline to Complex PTSD: The Long Way Around the Recovery Barn
I don't know if you will find new and helpful information in my post of the thread "Pugnacious vs. Pathetic: My Permanent Pendulum" on this sub-reddit, but you may.
Additionally, you find some psychological "weight reduction" in these books:
If one was regularly ignored, abandoned, discounted, disclaimed, and rejected -- as well as invalidated, confused, betrayed, insulted, criticized, judged, blamed, embarrassed, humiliated, victimized, demonized, persecuted, picked on, dumped on, bullied, scapegoated, and/or otherwise abused -- by others upon whom they depended for survival in early life, they may have been in-struct-ed, programmed, conditioned, socialized and/or normalized to their abuser's way of trying to deal with life. (Happens a lot.)
If you see yourself at stage two or higher on this list of the five stages of therapeutic recovery (and it sounds like you are), chances are very good that you will be able to do plenty to get a handle on your understandable compensations, because -- for a narcissist -- the hardest part of getting over it is getting to stage three.
Once there, however, here's the road map:
1) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do the next six things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the clinician locator on the Psychology Today website. Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
2) Support Groups: AA, MA and/or NA if one is using intoxicants to try to cope with emotional pain; ACA, EA and CoDA... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions.
3) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed for too long, including complex PTSD which sounds like at least a good possibility here: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. This article will get you oriented.
And additionally owing to your specific circumstances:
If one was regularly ignored, abandoned, discounted, disclaimed, and rejected -- as well as invalidated, confused, betrayed, insulted, criticized, judged, blamed, embarrassed, humiliated, victimized, demonized, persecuted, picked on, dumped on, bullied, scapegoated, and/or otherwise abused -- by others upon whom one depended for survival in early life, AND/OR is highly stressed by school, work, relationships or other chronic life challenges, they may develop a case of learned helplessness and C-PTSD.
If you relate to that description above, and it is the case, here's the road map out of the jungle:
1) Substance Abuse: IF one is using alcohol or other substances, they'll have to stop. SA can cause -- or worsen -- this in people with specific genetics and behavioral conditioning (see below). AA, MA and/or NA can be helpful. Or using the SAMHSA facility locator to find a detox & rehab.
2) If one is NOT doing the above, they may need lab work to determine if they have hormonal (e.g.: thyroid) or metabolic (e.g.: low Vitamin D3) imbalances. See a competent MD, DO, PA or NP. (To find one in your area, use this or get a referral from your GP/PC doc.)
3) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do next seven things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the clinician locator on the Psychology Today website (see below). Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
4) Support Groups: AA, MA and/or NA if one is using intoxicants to try to cope with emotional pain; ACA, EA and CoDA... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions.
5) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed for too long, including complex PTSD which sounds like at least a good possibility here: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. This article will get you oriented. Accurate information is power.
> On the other side, my mom defended me from bullies, drove me to school every day, cared for me and could be really sweet... This is confusing to me
This is precisely the reward-and-reinforcement mechanism people like Theo Lidz, Gregory Bateson, Paul Watzlawick, John Weakland, Don Jackson, Jay Haley, Virginia Satir, Jules Henry, Ronald D. Laing and Aaron Esterson saw two and three generations ago in the families of origin of their schizophrenic patients. And that Diana Baumrind ultimately saw after she did her original work on the various parenting styles. Having worked with well over a hundred people with BPD (not suggesting you have it), I have seen the flip-flop mother -- pretty likely stuck in learned helpless codependence to the intimidating, abusive, narcissistic father -- so many times in the families of origin of the BPD pts that I'm relatively certain it's a fairly common etiological set-up. In whatever event...
1) Substance Abuse: IF one is abusing alcohol, nicotine in any form, or other rec or Rx substances, they'll have to stop. SA can cause -- or worsen -- this in people with specific genetics and behavioral conditioning (see below). Alcoholics Anonymous, Marijuana Anonymous and/or Narcotics Anonymous can be helpful. Or using the SAMHSA facility locator online to find a detox & rehab.
2) If one is NOT doing the above, they may need lab work to determine if they have hormonal (e.g.: thyroid) or metabolic (e.g.: low Vitamin D3) imbalances. See a competent MD, DO, PA or NP. (To find one in your area, use the clinician locators mentioned below or get a referral from your GP/PC doc.)
3) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do next seven things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the physician locators below. Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
4) Support Groups: Adult Children of Alcoholics / Dysfunctional Families (ACA), Emotions Anonymous (EA), and Codependents Anonymous (CoDA)... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions. All of their websites have meeting locators.
5) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed into fight, flight or freeze for too long, including complex PTSD: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. Look for an online article entitled "Treat Autonomic AND Cognitive Conditions in Psychopathology?" to get you oriented. Accurate information is power. More books: Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
6) Psychotherapy: I currently use Ogden's Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T) as the "interoceptive" 9th of The 10 StEPs of Emotion Processing to manage any C-PTSD time bombs that turn up, but had good results over the years with several of the
. . . a) cognitive behavioral therapies (CBTs), including Rational-Emotive Behavioral Therapy (REBT), collegiate critical thinking, and Schema Therapy; the
. . . b) "super" (or mindfulness-based) CBTs like Mindfulness-Based Cognitive Therapy (MBCT), Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT), Acceptance & Commitment Therapy (ACT), Mind-Body Bridging Therapy (MBBT), and Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR); and the
. . . c) "deep cleaners" like Eye-Movement Desensitization & Reprocessing (EMDR), Hakomi Body Centered Psychotherapy (HBCP), Somatic Experiencing Psychotherapy (SEPt), Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T), and the Neuro-Affective Relational Model (NARM).
One can look up all of those by name online. The CBTs deconstruct one's inaccurate beliefs, values, ideals, principles, convictions, rules, codes, regulations and requirements about how we or they (or the world) should / must / ought / have to be. DBT, MBCT, ACT, MBBT and MBSR are terrific for emotional symptom management. EMDR, HBCT, SEPt, SP4T and NARM are first-rate for memory-reprocessing, sense-making and detachment from the conditioning, programming, etc.
To find the clinicians who know how to use these psychotherapies, look on the "therapists" and "psychiatrists" sections of the Psychology Today.com clinician locator, or the "find-a-doctor/specialty/psychiatry" section of the WebMD website; the SAMHSA's treatment facility locator, and -- for DBT specialists in particular -- on the Behavioraltech.org website. If you dig a little on each page, you will be able to see which therapies they use. Then interview them as though they were applying for a job with your company. Most psychiatrists, btw, are not therapists themselves (they are medication specialists), but can refer you to those who are, and are often excellent sources of referral.
7) Mindfulness Meditation: Try the Vipassana or Theravada Meditation styles? (For a lot of people with anxiety, unwanted mania and depression, this stuff handles them all chop chop. Many of the modern "mindfulness"-based psychotherapies are actually based on these now.) The article "The Feeling is Always Temporary" at pairadocks.blogspot.com provides a nice summation of it.
8) Therapy Workbooks: I got a lot of lift-off by using inexpensive workbooks built on CBT, ACT, DBT, MBBT and MBCT workbooks like these, and these, and these, and these.
9) Moderate Exercise: Because it is the single healthiest of the distractions one can use to yank oneself out of the paradigm for a while... and it can help to "massage" the brain so that it responds more quickly to psychotherapy.
10) Diet: A lot of people with depression, mania and/or anxiety eat very poorly. Junk food -- not to mention too little nutritious food -- will definitely impact those who are overly stressed and make symptoms worse. High-quality frozen meals are better than McFood of almost any kind, but HQ fresh (especially Mediterranean -- though not pizza -- and Asian) food appears to be best for pts with C-PTSD symptoms. Healthy fats in moderation, btw, are known to be good for depression. Add a 1000 IU soft gel of Vitamin D3, too.
Of the ten, #3 and #6 are the only ones that cost much, and several are totally free.
The Adult Children of Alcoholics & Dysfunctional Families perspective, for sure. Been around for about 40 years now. Good stuff.
If you're "bookish," at all, you can find out where the LC got most of her ideas:
Anonymous: Adult Children of Alcoholics: Alcoholic / Dysfunctional Families, Torrance, CA: ACA World Service Office, 2006.
Bradshaw, J.: Bradshaw On: The Family, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications, 1990.
Friel, J.; Friel, L.: Adult Children of Dysfunctional Families: The Secrets of Dysfunctional Families, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications Inc., 1990.
Whitfield, C.: The Child Within: Discovery and Recovery for Children of Dysfunctional Families, Deerfield Beach, FL: Health Communications Inc. 1987.
Woititz, J. G.: Adult Children of Alcoholics, Pompano Beach. FL: Health Communications, 1983.
Woititz, J. G.; Garner, A.: Life Skills for Adult Children of Alcoholics, Pompano Beach, FL: Health Communications, 1990.
And for those who are really bookish:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
Three words: Absolutely NO reactivity.
I usually reject the notion of "permanent policy" in favor of "being with what is right now in relationship." But...
Anyone who saps my energy without providing some replacement gets dropped. That may sound totalistic, but figure this: There are only so many minutes in the day to be of service to others who really need and want help. If they show me they are...
1) stuck at stage one of the five stages of therapeutic recovery or Kubler-Ross's five stages of grief processing,
2) resistant to rational and appropriate suggestions, or
3) the third of the four types of BPD, psychotically paranoid, righteously narcissistic and self-obsessed, passive-aggressive, anti-social or sociopathic...
I go into full-on counter-dependent, Ayn Rand Objectivist / lifeguard-with-a-non-swimmer-who-won't-follow-directions mode. (I am not "emotionally bullet-proof." I still need a bullet-proof vest.)
Because... the adequate and capable person who allows him- or herself to get sucked into the denial and/or resistance of those who want to be "rescued" (especially if their real motive is to "persecute") on a Karpman Drama Triangle with me will "victimize" and drown me if I let them. And those who really want and need help won't get it. Will they?
Might be worth reading some or all as processing devices:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Insofar as coping with their intrusions is concerned...
1) Keep the ringer on your phone off, and screen all calls and texts;
2) Change your email address, informing only those you know and trust;
3) Dump any social media accounts you have, or shut them down for the time being;
4) Know your persecutor (get him "right sized" instead of "bigger than you"): On Bullies and interpersonal D.A.R.V.O.;
5) Learn about learned helplessness, emotional blackmail and how to deal with them;
6) Keep this in mind: The Feeling is Always Temporary;
7) Learn & practice Distress Tolerance & Emotion Regulation.
> "I'm ignoring you while still vaguely acknowledging your existence in an abusive way" from a distance to try and break me and there's something in me that keeps digging for some kind of oral truth he'll never supply -- which drives me crazy and keeps me trapped
Only if we but their stuff as having some element of truth to it, make a down payment and then make installment payments on their utterances every time they make them. I'd look into "attachment theory" in general and "ambivalent" and "disorganized" attachment in particular. (John Bowlby was the big name in that stuff. It's definitely worth looking into because is the "fuel" that powers relationships on the Karpman Drama Triangle. The "persecutor" in the upper corner there is often "Mr. Revenge" to try to get out of the "victim" corner at the bottom.
> part of my mind froze over and is stuck
Of course. Children don't have the wherewithall to get out of the "victim" corner. And if a persecuting parent (or other authority figure) keeps shoving them down into the victim corner, they get conditioned, socialized and [normalized](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization_(sociology) to the whole drama in the brain's default mode network.
Hmm. Might wanna read some of these, even thought they tend to be about parents. If one understands that they may have found a new version of one or both parents in a romantic relationship -- and transferred the unprocessed emotions from the original onto the new one because it is similar in some ways -- it can help to connect some major mental dots sufficiently to give something like the 10 StEPs of Emotion Processing, Eye-Movement Desensitization & Reprocessing (EMDR), Narrative Exposure Therapy (NET), Internal Family Systems Therapy (IFST), Trauma Focused Therapy (TFT), Hakomi Body Centered Psychotherapy (HBCP), Somatic Experiencing Psychotherapy (SEPt), Sensorimotor Processing for Trauma (SP4T), or the Neuro-Affective Relational Model (NARM) a chance to "digest" those emotions.
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
> Does it subside or get better?
Left untreated, my parents' abuse did little other than fester, and at times erupt in unfortunate ways.
> She used to stare at me with squinted eyes, and would randomly blurt out things that she had somehow “figured out” about me, most of which was untrue and weird.
I never thought I'd ever read anyone else's description of that experience.
> it seems like she thought she knew me more than I knew myself, and really enjoyed telling me insights about my behavior and making assumptions.
"Righteous narcissism." Once I understood why my own mother needed that so desperately as a defense against her own fear of being abused again (and be denied her reality as her mother and grandmother had denied it after she was raped by her cousin when she was nine), I could see her and I very clearly pushing each other around on our little Karpman Drama Triangle. Sick.
I had to read book like these (below) and steep myself in ACA and CoDA to get the bitterness to subside.
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
Alexander Chapman & Kimberly Gratz's The Borderline Personality Disorder Survival Guide: Everything You Need to Know About Living with BPD
Block, S.; Block, C.: Mind-Body Workbook for Anger, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2013.
Chapman, A.; Gratz, K.; Tull, M.: The Dialectical Behavior Therapy Skills Workbook for Anger: Using DBT Mindfulness & Emotion Regulation Skills to Manage Anger, Oakland CA: New Harbinger, 2015.
Eifert, G.; McKay, M.; Forsyth, J.: ACT on life not anger: The New Acceptance & Commitment Therapy Guide to Problem Anger, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2006.
Harbin, T.: Beyond Anger: a guide for me: How to Free Yourself from the Grip of Anger and Get More Out of Life, New York: Marlowe & Company, 2000.
McKay, M.; Rogers, P.: The Anger Control Workbook: Simple, innovative techniques for managing anger and developing healthier ways of relating; Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2000.
McKay, M.; Rogers, P.; McKay, J.: When Anger Hurts: Quieting the Storm Within, 2nd Ed., Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2003.
Simpkins, C. A.; Simpkins, A. M.: The Tao of Bipolar: Using Meditation & Mindfulness to Find Balance & Peace, Oakland, CA: New Harbinger, 2013.
Stahl, B.; Goldstein, E.: A Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction Workbook, Oakland CA: New Harbinger, 2010.
Rule of thumb for this abusee: NEVER confront an abuser without giving it plenty of forethought.
Here's a pick-up that may be pointless after the corral gate got opened and the horses ran off, but...
Confronting Abusers & Handling Rage Effectively
And... as regards dealing with the upshots:
Recovering from Shame
The Feeling is Always Temporary
Distress Tolerance & Emotion Regulation
Finally, some books to help your process the abuse without getting into it with either parent:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
I've been a witness to this on several occasions. Some won judgments. Others got nothing but grief. And the ones who "won" judgments paid a significant price during the depositions they had to give the defense attorneys.
What you elect to do is your own business, of course. I could have "played nice" and come away with a pretty good nest egg when my adoptive mother finally passed. But she was such an insufferably self-righteous fraud (as well as abusive to my spouse), that I just walked away. After reading books like those listed below, I'm convinced now that I would have done myself a lot more damage to just remain in contact, let alone have to fight with her and her attorneys for a few years.
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
> homeschooled me from kindergarten to 7th grade
We're seeing more and more of this from the second-, third- and fourth-generation victims of traumatized mothers who tried to cope with their unfinished business by trying to control everyone and everything around them to whatever extent possible. Sigh.
> the leaders of this church are extremely manipulative, they would tell my mom I️ was the devil, that I️ was possessed because I️ listened to the radio, that I️ was teaching all the other children to do bad things.
Another widely observed phenomenon among survivors. To that end, may I suggest having a look at the articles at the links below? (I was raised in an extreme, evangelical Xtian world, btw. And it set me up to chase "The Answer" in one cult after another in my 20s and 30s.)
Codependence & Cults
Coercive Persuasion in Cults
I had to be de-programmed from the instruction, conditioning, indoctrineation, socialization, habituation and (invisible to me) normalization of my home and church (as well as other cult) upbringing... after all that brainwashing took me the gates of CPTSD hell (including 11 hospitalizations and two wake-up-in-the-ICU suicide attempts) from '94 to '03. I'm not in that box / frame / institution / paradigm anymore. And how I got from there to here is summarized in the earlier post at the link below:
From Bipolar to Borderline to Complex PTSD: The Long Way Around the Recovery Barn
Hmm. Some books that were helpful for me that may be helpful for you:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
Pretty similar FoO background here. Had to do all the stuff listed in the earlier post at the link below to dig out of the upshots to the extent that I have. Have also read and done the work suggested in the books listed after that first link.
From Bipolar to Borderline to Complex PTSD: The Long Way Around the Recovery Barn
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
I don't know if you will find new and helpful information in my post of the thread "Pugnacious vs. Pathetic: My Permanent Pendulum" on this sub-reddit, but you may.
Additionally, you find some psychological "weight reduction" in these books:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
If one was regularly ignored, abandoned, discounted, disclaimed, and rejected -- as well as invalidated, confused, betrayed, insulted, criticized, judged, blamed, embarrassed, humiliated, victimized, demonized, persecuted, picked on, dumped on, bullied, scapegoated, and/or otherwise abused -- by others upon whom they depended for survival in early life, they may have been in-struct-ed, programmed, conditioned, socialized and/or normalized to their abuser's way of trying to deal with life. (Happens a lot.)
If you see yourself at stage two or higher on this list of the five stages of therapeutic recovery (and it sounds like you are), chances are very good that you will be able to do plenty to get a handle on your understandable compensations, because -- for a narcissist -- the hardest part of getting over it is getting to stage three.
Once there, however, here's the road map:
1) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do the next six things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the clinician locator on the Psychology Today website. Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
2) Support Groups: AA, MA and/or NA if one is using intoxicants to try to cope with emotional pain; ACA, EA and CoDA... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions.
3) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed for too long, including complex PTSD which sounds like at least a good possibility here: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. This article will get you oriented.
And additionally owing to your specific circumstances:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
Accurate information is power.
see the remainder below
If one was regularly ignored, abandoned, discounted, disclaimed, and rejected -- as well as invalidated, confused, betrayed, insulted, criticized, judged, blamed, embarrassed, humiliated, victimized, demonized, persecuted, picked on, dumped on, bullied, scapegoated, and/or otherwise abused -- by others upon whom one depended for survival in early life, AND/OR is highly stressed by school, work, relationships or other chronic life challenges, they may develop a case of learned helplessness and C-PTSD.
If you relate to that description above, and it is the case, here's the road map out of the jungle:
1) Substance Abuse: IF one is using alcohol or other substances, they'll have to stop. SA can cause -- or worsen -- this in people with specific genetics and behavioral conditioning (see below). AA, MA and/or NA can be helpful. Or using the SAMHSA facility locator to find a detox & rehab.
2) If one is NOT doing the above, they may need lab work to determine if they have hormonal (e.g.: thyroid) or metabolic (e.g.: low Vitamin D3) imbalances. See a competent MD, DO, PA or NP. (To find one in your area, use this or get a referral from your GP/PC doc.)
3) Medications, but only if really needed to get one stabilized enough to do next seven things on this list: Find a board certified psychopharmacologist in your area by using the clinician locator on the Psychology Today website (see below). Getting psych meds from a GP or primary care doc can be useless or even risky. Psych diagnoses, meds and med interactions are just too complex now for most GPs and primary care docs.
4) Support Groups: AA, MA and/or NA if one is using intoxicants to try to cope with emotional pain; ACA, EA and CoDA... where you will find others in similar boats who have found explanations, answers and solutions.
5) Books and academic, professional websites including Mayo Clinic, WebMD, NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health), NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), and even Wikipedia (when everything asserted is solidly documented with citations). Strongly recommended because they all understand the upshots of having been stressed for too long, including complex PTSD which sounds like at least a good possibility here: Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Levine, Patricia Ogden, Ronald Kurtz, Laurence Heller, Bruce McEwen, Sonya Lupien and Robert Sapolsky. This article will get you oriented. Accurate information is power.
Additionally:
Nina Brown's Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents
Eleanor Payson's The Wizard of Oz and other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way Relationship in Work, Love, and Family
Lindsay Gibson's Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents
Elan Golomb's Trapped in the Mirror: Adult Children of Narcissists in the Struggle for Self
Susan Forward's Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life (a bit long in tooth now, but still useful) and Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
Kimberlee Roth & Frieda Friedman's Surviving a Borderline Parent: How to Heal Your Childhood Wounds & Build Trust, Boundaries, and Self-Esteem
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